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What changed your opinion? I remember you organizing that quest and suggesting crowdfunding.
Manuscript Quest: Secrets Of The Golden R+C
- Thread starter True Initiate
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What changed your opinion? I remember you organizing that quest and suggesting crowdfunding.
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No matter the reason, it doesn't mean I won't go there and check it out, and if possible, make pics and send them to you.
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This is my translation of the text of the first Labor (5th Grade). As you will have noticed already, I am no professional or native english speaker/translator. But I hope it serves you better than Goolge Translate. It's very hard for me to translate these old texts, as they used very long passages between the sentences. I think that's pretty elegant (the sentences -not my translation) though I am not used to translate these kind of texts.
Text in square brackets are alternative words inserted by me to possibly provide a better understanding. The content in round brackets exists in the original text, but I failed to include it into the flow of the text.
Labor Imus or the attraction of the air-spirit
First the worthy brother has to choose [find] a habitation in a remote, free, slightly elevated place, always filled with fresh air, to prepare inside a comfortable room or chamber , in which exists a window to the Orient: In said chamber all openings have to be well closed and a pane taken out of the one single window pointing towards the Orient, or if there are wooden shutters, one has to cut out a round hole in the diameter of a pan in which is put a big funnel made of glass or white sheet (see Fig. A) from outside. Above the funnel must hang a leaden cover B., which has to be opened with a line when the air is pure and closed when the weather is cloudy. In the end of the funnel a pipe C. of the same Materia and the length of an arm that sharpens towards one end, has to be put, that leads into the canal of the tubulated flask Lit. D, where a wide helmet Lit. E has to be applicated, from which the snout goes into Lit. F. The flask lies in an earthen sand Capelle Lit. G on (symbol of tin), which is standing on a small iron oven Lit. H, like it is clearly shown in the drawing of the machines.
If the air is clean and cool, the cover of the funnel will be opened and a gentle fire is made in the oven, so that the ash only reaches the warmth of the first grade of a B.M. Like this, these calor as an Attractivum will draw [suck] the earth-spiritum (which is hidden from our eyes) with great power and make it visible and touchable in aqua-form very quickly.
But should the air be not cool or tempered, but hot and humid, one must replace the ashes with Sal Communis that is put into a tinnen bowl placed on ice. This way the same effect like with the fire will be observed.
NB. This operation must begin each time at dawn and be ended around the 9th hour.
After the worthy brother has collected a sufficient quantity of this birth giving, feeding and as well consuming and then again birth giving, common world-, air and life-spirit, he has to put it into some clean glasses with ingrained plugs and store them at a cool place until needed. But the glasses have to be completely full, otherwise this alive-making spirit would start its Circulationes in the empty space in between, and exactly like the whole earth arose, when it was created in and out of the water, because the spirit of god was floating there above, this inseperable Quintum esse as a ruler of the beautiful daughters of god (nature) would separate the Terra out of the Aqua at a time that is unwanted now. With the recommendation to the worthy brother, that he preferably undertakes the attraction of the spirit in the first 2 balmy month May and June, we will finish the first Labor and go on from Keter to Chochma.
Text in square brackets are alternative words inserted by me to possibly provide a better understanding. The content in round brackets exists in the original text, but I failed to include it into the flow of the text.
Labor Imus or the attraction of the air-spirit
First the worthy brother has to choose [find] a habitation in a remote, free, slightly elevated place, always filled with fresh air, to prepare inside a comfortable room or chamber , in which exists a window to the Orient: In said chamber all openings have to be well closed and a pane taken out of the one single window pointing towards the Orient, or if there are wooden shutters, one has to cut out a round hole in the diameter of a pan in which is put a big funnel made of glass or white sheet (see Fig. A) from outside. Above the funnel must hang a leaden cover B., which has to be opened with a line when the air is pure and closed when the weather is cloudy. In the end of the funnel a pipe C. of the same Materia and the length of an arm that sharpens towards one end, has to be put, that leads into the canal of the tubulated flask Lit. D, where a wide helmet Lit. E has to be applicated, from which the snout goes into Lit. F. The flask lies in an earthen sand Capelle Lit. G on (symbol of tin), which is standing on a small iron oven Lit. H, like it is clearly shown in the drawing of the machines.
If the air is clean and cool, the cover of the funnel will be opened and a gentle fire is made in the oven, so that the ash only reaches the warmth of the first grade of a B.M. Like this, these calor as an Attractivum will draw [suck] the earth-spiritum (which is hidden from our eyes) with great power and make it visible and touchable in aqua-form very quickly.
But should the air be not cool or tempered, but hot and humid, one must replace the ashes with Sal Communis that is put into a tinnen bowl placed on ice. This way the same effect like with the fire will be observed.
NB. This operation must begin each time at dawn and be ended around the 9th hour.
After the worthy brother has collected a sufficient quantity of this birth giving, feeding and as well consuming and then again birth giving, common world-, air and life-spirit, he has to put it into some clean glasses with ingrained plugs and store them at a cool place until needed. But the glasses have to be completely full, otherwise this alive-making spirit would start its Circulationes in the empty space in between, and exactly like the whole earth arose, when it was created in and out of the water, because the spirit of god was floating there above, this inseperable Quintum esse as a ruler of the beautiful daughters of god (nature) would separate the Terra out of the Aqua at a time that is unwanted now. With the recommendation to the worthy brother, that he preferably undertakes the attraction of the spirit in the first 2 balmy month May and June, we will finish the first Labor and go on from Keter to Chochma.
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I extracted those passages for those who think/believe it's common dew that we're after
If we wanted to collect common dew, there are much easier and more efficient ways...
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I extracted those passages for those who think/believe it's common dew that we're after
If we wanted to collect common dew, there are much easier and more efficient ways...
Two things I've noticed:
1.The metal maybe is used because of a better thermal conductivity.
2. Neither in this nor in the Bacstrom setup a (for dew collection) sensible airflow is possible. In contrary, the air is more likely sucked off the receiver creating a low pressure (a Null Zone?).
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All I'm saying is that it's very unlikely that those "devices" are meant for condensing common dew.
FF, when I have some time to transcribe it, I'll PM you the details of an experiment made by someone using such a type of device + a tip or two.
After that, I don't believe I can be of any further assistance with this line particular line of research, as I myself have not been working along these lines for a long time. Not because it's useless, but because I'm experimenting with a few "better" ways to obtain a "product" of higher purity & potency.
FF, when I have some time to transcribe it, I'll PM you the details of an experiment made by someone using such a type of device + a tip or two.
After that, I don't believe I can be of any further assistance with this line particular line of research, as I myself have not been working along these lines for a long time. Not because it's useless, but because I'm experimenting with a few "better" ways to obtain a "product" of higher purity & potency.
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Thanks! I'm looking forward to see that!
And, if I may ask, have your "better" ways some bonds to the Ormus community?
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Here is my translation of the introduction to those processes of which we have the first two steps so far:
It should be placed before the already translated first step.
"A to this holy work appointed brother and adept needs to well know and understand, before he begins with his operations, what the dew of heavens[sky?/fire?] and the fats of the earth[soil?] are, so he won't err and take it quid pro quo. We don't want to have understood here neither the dew, which coagulates when falling and in the moment when it touches something gets half-specified, nor the fats of the earth[soil?] itself in a whole, but only the pure Spiritum Mundi and the virgin [unconcubinated] Sal Terrae like we will show in the following."
And here comes my translation of the second step:
Labor IIdus. The collection of the virgin earth
This should happen almost contemporaneously with the first step above as follows: After the worthy brother has chosen a sublime, well flowered field, meadow or garden freed of swamp and moss, filled with black or red volaric [flying? volatile?] ground [soil], he goes to said place early in the morning before sunrise when the weather is bright and pure and digs until under the vegetable roots approxiametly three hand margins [100 cm]deep and draws five pounds [2.5 kg] of this earth with a small wooden shovel into a glassed vessel and cover it immediately so that nothing heterogenous gets inside. Then he proceeds as follows: This earth must be spread on one big, severel small and very flat earthen or glass bowls as high as a finger is wide and put to a place where it is well protected of dew and wind, rain and sunshine too, to attract the air-Spiritus and to dry the earthen mouisture. They have to be covered with glass helmets or bowls when the weather is cloudy, humid air, rain, storm and thunderstorms and reopened only when the sky [heaven?] is pure. After one has done this the whole month of may or june this earth has to be sieved through a sieve (with holes not too small) to get rid of gravel and sand, because if this earth indurated to sand and stone would stay inside and solves too much of the World-Spirit, this cloudy and sandy being would cause a glass-like [matter], which would be a hindrance to the work and brings damage.
[Two pictures soon, see Spiritus Mundi thread]
[End of step two]
Bayer then says:
Following to this:
3. "The first chaotic Conjuction and putrefaction"
4."The Solutio et Resolutio Terrae in B.M."
5."The whole abstraction per gradus in sand"
6."The de-phlagmation of the Menstrui in B.M."
7. "The Calcinatio Terrae et Extractio Salis"
8."The Conjunctio et Cohobatio Salis"
9. "The Solutio, Putrefactio, Coagulatio, et Plusquamperfectio Solis ad Lapidem"
10."The multiplication and projection".
Those last eight stages missing are yet to be found in the MS at the "Geheimes Staatsarchiv Berlin" or at that R+C Lodge in Sweden.
It should be placed before the already translated first step.
"A to this holy work appointed brother and adept needs to well know and understand, before he begins with his operations, what the dew of heavens[sky?/fire?] and the fats of the earth[soil?] are, so he won't err and take it quid pro quo. We don't want to have understood here neither the dew, which coagulates when falling and in the moment when it touches something gets half-specified, nor the fats of the earth[soil?] itself in a whole, but only the pure Spiritum Mundi and the virgin [unconcubinated] Sal Terrae like we will show in the following."
And here comes my translation of the second step:
Labor IIdus. The collection of the virgin earth
This should happen almost contemporaneously with the first step above as follows: After the worthy brother has chosen a sublime, well flowered field, meadow or garden freed of swamp and moss, filled with black or red volaric [flying? volatile?] ground [soil], he goes to said place early in the morning before sunrise when the weather is bright and pure and digs until under the vegetable roots approxiametly three hand margins [100 cm]deep and draws five pounds [2.5 kg] of this earth with a small wooden shovel into a glassed vessel and cover it immediately so that nothing heterogenous gets inside. Then he proceeds as follows: This earth must be spread on one big, severel small and very flat earthen or glass bowls as high as a finger is wide and put to a place where it is well protected of dew and wind, rain and sunshine too, to attract the air-Spiritus and to dry the earthen mouisture. They have to be covered with glass helmets or bowls when the weather is cloudy, humid air, rain, storm and thunderstorms and reopened only when the sky [heaven?] is pure. After one has done this the whole month of may or june this earth has to be sieved through a sieve (with holes not too small) to get rid of gravel and sand, because if this earth indurated to sand and stone would stay inside and solves too much of the World-Spirit, this cloudy and sandy being would cause a glass-like [matter], which would be a hindrance to the work and brings damage.
[Two pictures soon, see Spiritus Mundi thread]
[End of step two]
Bayer then says:
Following to this:
3. "The first chaotic Conjuction and putrefaction"
4."The Solutio et Resolutio Terrae in B.M."
5."The whole abstraction per gradus in sand"
6."The de-phlagmation of the Menstrui in B.M."
7. "The Calcinatio Terrae et Extractio Salis"
8."The Conjunctio et Cohobatio Salis"
9. "The Solutio, Putrefactio, Coagulatio, et Plusquamperfectio Solis ad Lapidem"
10."The multiplication and projection".
Those last eight stages missing are yet to be found in the MS at the "Geheimes Staatsarchiv Berlin" or at that R+C Lodge in Sweden.
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Andro, may i please hear the experiment and tips and tricks please?
Also I was wondering; if your not working like this anymore; is wuat your doing somehow similar? Or have you ditched the moisture from the air bit all together?
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The "Secret State Archive" library in Berlin is pretty easy, scans are available for certain prices, signed up for a library card --- only "problem" is that the texts in question are in the FM section (Freimaurer/Freemasons) and one needs special permission from the guy who is responsible for that section, and that guy happened not to be there today. Will hopefully try to go there again next week, time permitting, meet the guy and hopefully get the required "special permission" to access those particular texts. Once I have access, I can apparently also take a phone pic to assess the readability. Will update when relevant.
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Thanks a lot, Andro!
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Awesome, Andro! Godspeed!
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Apparently I cannot make those scans publicly available (it's technically illegal and I will have to sign a legally binding agreement), so it would have to be more of a "private" enterprise. Their good quality scans are also not very cheap (TIFF format, 300 DPI - delivered on a CD or DVD), and at this point so far, the most genuinely interested parties are limited to Florius Frammel and True Initiate. In addition to the 5th grade (of which FF posted an excerpt and kindly translated it), I also inquired about the 8th grade, the one that True Initiate is interested in. They have them both at the Library, but if I obtain them, we will have to make the proper arrangements via PM or email will FF and TI, at least in the beginning... What happens afterwards, we'll just have to see
I have faith
I have faith
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Apparently I cannot make those scans publicly available (it's technically illegal and I will have to sign a legally binding agreement), so it would have to be more of a "private" enterprise. Their good quality scans are also not very cheap (TIFF format, 300 DPI - delivered on a CD or DVD), and at this point so far, the most genuinely interested parties are limited to Florius Frammel and True Initiate. In addition to the 5th grade (of which FF posted an excerpt and kindly translated it), I also inquired about the 8th grade, the one that True Initiate is interested in. They have them both at the Library, but if I obtain them, we will have to make the proper arrangements via PM or email will FF and TI, at least in the beginning... What happens afterwards, we'll just have to see
I have faith
Nice plan, thanks again!
It has been a long time since I read from TI. Hope he's doing well!
I'm curious if they will be readable. Maybe we can avoid legal issues in publishing an english translation here. But I'm not 100% sure about this "backdoor" being legal.
How much exactly is the price for the scans?
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They decide what scan level they can offer me... They're very particular with their regulations
Generally, it's 4 EUR per page for the "good" quality (in color, TIFF, 300 DPI, etc...) and 50 cents per page for Black & White, lower quality.
However, it can reach 18 EUR per page for certain types of scans (electronic photography, I think they call it...).
I'll be better informed next time I go there and I'll report back here.
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[Forget it. ]
]
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Everyone potentially interested - let's take it one step at the time... First thing is to get that "special permission" from the "Freemason" dude
I feel this can be a significant (and apparently quite rare) text for quite a few people here, and there's no desire to deny anyone who's interested, we just have to do it smartly... so we shall "Handle With Care"... I just happen to live a short drive away from the "Secret State Archive" in Berlin, so I am currently trying to see this through to the best of my ability... Patience...
I feel this can be a significant (and apparently quite rare) text for quite a few people here, and there's no desire to deny anyone who's interested, we just have to do it smartly... so we shall "Handle With Care"... I just happen to live a short drive away from the "Secret State Archive" in Berlin, so I am currently trying to see this through to the best of my ability... Patience...
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I think Michael is mainly interested in that other book.
Besides Michael, your inbox is full since quite some time..
Besides Michael, your inbox is full since quite some time..
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Thank you, Florius. There was some temporary confusion on my part. It's all good.
Good to know that my inbox is full. Was wondering why nobody wants to talk to me anymore.
Will make some space.
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Please keep me informed. Depending on the cost, I am also interested.
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The cheapest way to do this (imho):
Scan one page in cheapest low-res mode and look if it's readable. If yes ->Do like this with all pages.
If one or more pages aren't readable in low-res mode, scan them with next higher level.
I'm pretty sure now to avoid legal issues in publishing a translation, because then it's no longer the original script. At least four of the people I know that are at least slightly interested in this may help in sharing translation work. Depending on how many people are interested, those could (or not) be free from the payment, as it is already paid with their work. But we can talk about that.
What do you think about that idea?
Scan one page in cheapest low-res mode and look if it's readable. If yes ->Do like this with all pages.
If one or more pages aren't readable in low-res mode, scan them with next higher level.
I'm pretty sure now to avoid legal issues in publishing a translation, because then it's no longer the original script. At least four of the people I know that are at least slightly interested in this may help in sharing translation work. Depending on how many people are interested, those could (or not) be free from the payment, as it is already paid with their work. But we can talk about that.
What do you think about that idea?
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Sounds simpler to do one typical page in low-resolution first, and if that is readable, then do the whole book in low resolution and THEN decide which pages need higher resolution.